Posted by
Street Carnage
• 09.06.12 11:00 am

Gavin started a thread last night on the Jim Goad Facebook group that cut to the chase on race.

Except for some random meanderings and comments by people who aren’t regular SC contributors, we’re reproducing the comments here unedited.

Gavin McInnes
Ever notice how the ones screaming ra-a-a-a-cism are always white and the ones they are screaming it at are the same kinds of people the KKK was chasing down the street 50 years ago?

Me: Married an American Indian and made babies
Jim Goad: Lives in an all black neighborhood
John Derbyshire: Married an Asian and made babies
Naomi Schaefer Riley (fired for mocking black studies): Married a black man and made babies
Lesley Arfin (hipster racist writer for HBO’s “Girls”): Jewish
Kyria Abrahams (hipster racist): Dating a black hispanic
Juan Williams (fired for implying Islam can be scary): Black hispanic
Rick Sanchez (fired for pointing out his bosses are Jewish): Hispanic

In the new war against racism we have whites attacking Jews, race mixers, and coloreds.


Lasse Holmberg Josephsen
I’ve been called a Nazi and a racist. I haven’t told my Jewish girlfriend that I secretly want to exterminate her.

I’ve also been called a race traitor.

It’s good to know that I can annoy both sides.

Every time I’ve fucked a non-white girl, it was out of pure hatred.


Kyria Lydia Abrahams
Recently I’ve been thinking a lot about the quote: “To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize.” The people who claim to be discriminated against are really the ones in power. They tell other people what they can and cannot say.


Gavin McInnes
They speak on behalf of blacks who have no idea any of this gay dialogue is going on (nor do they give a shit). I think the only exception to the power thing is Islam. PC whites don’t let you criticize Muslims and Muslims are on board.


Kyria Lydia Abrahams
The people who always talk about “opening a dialogue” are the ones who usually shut down all dialogue.

My black Hispanic says this is really interesting and you should write an article on this. But I don’t pay him much mind.


Marcus Lydia Enriquez
Get back in the Kitchen (Read: Oven)


Gavin McInnes
I honestly can’t conceive of a real black saying, “That’s actually really racist.” A friend is a teacher in Bushwick and when he banned the word “nigger” from his class his students were all, “Oooooh-kaaaay.” It was like he had said they can’t say “the” or “television.” They just shrugged and replaced it with “neighbor” and “ninja.” Racism is a white thing.


Marcus Lydia Enriquez
Seriously Gavin, this is a great observation.


Kyria Lydia Abrahams
When I hear that someone is “offended” by a word they have taken out of context, this what they are really saying to me:

“I know you didn’t mean anything hurtful, but I feel like making this conversation all about me! So I’m gonna go ahead and claim I am *offended*, because that means you have to apologize to me. And I don’t actually have to justify that you did anything wrong because I can be offended by you independent of your intentions. Now pay attention to me!”


Jim Goad
Steve Sailer has the best take on this subject I’ve seen. He’s always said that all this racism-accusing has nothing to do with nonwhites and is all about status-jockeying among whites.


Kyria Lydia Abrahams
Someone recently told me that Steve Sailer is a “nazi” and when I asked why, he couldn’t come up with any concrete examples, but said something about his stats being off and it being too difficult to explain because it goes so deep.

I noted that I would probably reserve all judgment until I had some information.


Gavin McInnes
Less than 10% of whites marry outside their race and if you take Jewish men marrying Asians out of the equation, I’ll wager it’s less than half that. Can you even conceive of Salon’s Alex Pareene or Gawker’s Hamilton Nolan marrying a black woman or living in a black neighborhood? You can’t just listen to them rap or tell people what to call them when you’re married. You have to actually fuck them.


Jim Goad
I also wrote about something similar in “The Redneck Manifesto.” Up in the North Portland neighborhood of St. Johns, which at least when I moved there in the mid-90s was known as the “white trash” section, had integrated bars while all the white people downtown—and that’s all there were downtown—were calling me a racist.

That was the hilarious thing about the SHARPs in Portland, too. They had one Vietnamese kid, or whatever the fuck he was. Otherwise, a wall of vanilla.


Gavin McInnes
That’s what I love about the South (and real NY for that matter). They’re so in each other’s faces, they can’t bullshit anymore. Charlotte NC is about half white and half other and they have bars for each. If a black person is at a white bar, nobody notices and vice versa. If a Gawker blogger went to Harlem, he’d probably have a heart attack.


Jim Goad
We should challenge the Gawker geeks to walk through the hood with us….

See, OK, Koreans I’m racist against.

I’m talking about the imports. I’ve never had bad experiences with Asians—EXCEPT for Koreans. And I’ve had enough bad experiences with enough awful Koreans, at this point I think it’s mathematically impossible that they don’t have a genetic personality flaw.

I’m postjudiced. I’ve made informed decisions after repeated exposure to different groups. Some I like, some I don’t.

The idea of “prejudice” is preposterous because it assumes you’d like everyone if you only spent enough time with them. Wrong-o!


Kyria Lydia Abrahams
The only people I’ve had issues with are Jews, specifically Jewish boyfriends. That is cultural, and it only started when I spent a lot of time around them. I consistently found their families to be dysfunctional, withholding, and self righteous. Go sort out your weird mother issues on someone else’s time. It made me uncomfortable. I’ll just be over here in my “goy” house, eating ham and not being creepy with the people I love.


Marcus Lydia Enriquez
I remember walking the dog when I lived in suburban Central NJ, I routinely encountered terrified white ladies. I didn’t really judge them for being a little scared of me since I’m big and don’t look like them, etc. I would go out of my way to smile and set them at ease.

It also made it all the more surprising when I raped them.


Gavin McInnes
Also, Lou Dobbs is a horrible racist who hates all Mexicans because he’s for controlling the borders. The fact that he’s married to one and spoons her every night is irrelevant.

‎”If you love all these Mexicans so much, why don’t you fuck them ? I do and I don’t mean metaphorically.” -Lou Dobbs


Marcus Lydia Enriquez


Gavin McInnes
@Marcus, at the beginning of “The Bell Curve” they clearly say these are generalizations and to apply them to an individual is wrong. Irish get ornery when they drink whiskey. That doesn’t apply to every Irishman.

If I was black and some old lady grabbed her purse in the elevator I’d think, “Thanks a lot, other blacks for making this woman scared of me.”


Jim Goad
Yes, and there’s a general principle that exceptions, by themselves, don’t disprove a rule. Or at least they don’t obliterate what are clear statistical patterns. You can quibble forever over why the statistics skew that way, but exceptions don’t eradicate patterns.


Gavin McInnes


Marcus Lydia Enriquez
Hey Gavin, I’ve never read the Bell Curve, but I’d agree with that statement.

I think where I was going with that comment before it degraded into a joke was that there is a fine line between being bigoted towards an entire group of people for your experience with a small set of that group and simply learning from your experience.

It’s like the whole racial profiling thing. The ladies in my neighborhood who were scared of me weren’t racists, there was a nearby area filled with black and spanish people that was scary as hell. The kids from that neighborhood would sometimes end up in mine, wandering around and then magically the next day, cars would be vandalized.

I acknowledged that they could easily mistake me for one of them based on my looks, and when I smiled at them, they smiled back and their demeanors changed.

If they were actually racist, it wouldn’t have changed a damn thing if I was nice to them, because they would think that ALL Spanish and black people are criminals.


Kyria Lydia Abrahams


…to be continued, probably forever…


  1. Oprah says:

    You guys made some valid points. And it’s obvious everyone on this “panel” has a large BLACK stick stuck up their ass. The fact that the beginning of the post started with each panels interracial relationship and “evidence” that they are not racist is retarded. I get it your sick of people calling you racist just because your “white”. I do agree we live in a hyper sensitive environment, but that doesn’t give you the right to denounce the criticism of racism in America. We do not live in a post racial world. If you accept that maybe we can move the fuck on from this conversation. What happen to you Street Carnage…it’s like I’m reading a Tyler Perry hate forum. You know what is racist I can’t find nude tights for my skin tone.

  2. Hipster Racism was way cooler before they started selling Klan hoods in Urban Outfitters.

  3. In 2012, you can be branded as a racist without actually thinking that other people are inferior to you. Being racist has nothing to do with being “racist” any more. And then you get to lose your career over it. Hooray for society. We are so loving and inclusive and in no way hypocritical or cruel. Yay.

  4. icantslowdown says:


  5. 000 says:

    I think the best way to explain the mentalility of this (and it’s probably going to sound crazy)is that most people view the world in a mostly predatory way.Its naturally human to have a certain amount of selfishness….Hell it’s probably even healthy.Your mind is fucked if it thinks in a victim/victimizer worldview though.A lot of liberally minded people think the world has some kind of game that needs to be rewritten so that they can understand the rules.They have no idea what the standards to declare something rascist is.My bar for whether someone is rascist is whether they coinsider the race or group theyre slandering a type of vermin.That’s when shit gets terrible.

  6. Jim Goad says:

    Protip for “Oprah”…

    Dumb move to call people “retarded” when you’re actually so retarded you don’t know the difference between “your” and “you’re.”

    No one gives a shit about the BAD BAD EVIL NAMES you toss out like greasy queefs, and no one needs your approval.


  7. >And it’s obvious everyone on this “panel” has a large BLACK stick stuck up their ass.

    That’s an African American stick up in there. Get it right.

    >The fact that the beginning of the post started with each panels interracial relationship and “evidence” that they are not racist is retarded.

    How is it not evidence? People don’t usually marry people that they hate.

    >I get it your sick of people calling you racist just because your “white”.

    I’m Puerto Rican and I’m sick of people calling my white friends racist because they don’t tiptoe around people, desperately trying not to offend anyone as if they were the great white protectors of all minorities.

    >We do not live in a post racial world. If you accept that maybe we can move the fuck on from this conversation.

    Who said the world was post racial? Who the fuck are you arguing against? You’re being post-logic.

    > What happen to you Street Carnage…it’s like I’m reading a Tyler Perry hate forum.

  8. Hornblower's Ghost says:

    Jim I think you’re over reacting to Oprah’s comment. Oprah didn’t call any of you retarded, he/she said that rolling out a list of interracial relationships is retarded, and it is. It’s the “I have a black friend argument”, except it’s “I fuck a black person”. Slave masters liked to fuck the black slaves when nobody was looking too! That’s not an argument for their real progressiveness. I’m not a fan of white, liberal, hustlers either, I think they run a con when it comes to race, and simply use people for a show of diversity, and protest too much out of the cognitive dissonance of seeing themselves as so progressive, yet they want nothing to really do with being any where near groups of people not like them. The real progressive is the token in the room tolerating them… Though Oprah’s right, we’re not in a post racial world, and a lot of subtle, institutionalized racism, gets treated like pointing out unicorns, because white, liberal, hustlers keep over using the word racist and wind up looking ridiculous trying to still pretend that racism today is someone in a hood screaming nigger… It doesn’t help that they’re always on a quest to get people fired over language, as if changing language changes real world conditions. Why can’t I just not like you, and you not like me and we’re both free to voice that opinion as long as we don’t block each other’s progress in life?

  9. pfft says:

    Sanchez once called President Barack Obama a “cotton-picking president,”

    Gavin- shut the fuck up.

  10. John says:


  11. heroin town says:

    People who are legitimately tired of “Racism” Hunters should move to a latin american country or neighborhood. Hispanics don’t wring their hands over this stuff; in fact they tend to joke about it. A lot of them are mixed and the girls are hot as fuck.

    I know that there are still racists out there and that (to some extent) racism does still dictate how you’ll be treated in society. But a noisy minority of black people take that fact too damn far, let it weigh too heavily on them and are generally obnoxious about it. Honestly, it seems that other groups don’t make half the stink about it that some black people try to.

    And not to go off topic here, but reverse racism (actual animosity for someone because they are white) doesn’t carry half the social stigma that white racism does. In fact it gets a pass because it’s “justified.”

  12. heroin town says:

    And just for clarification: I have no problem when people try to tackle legitimate instances of racism. It’s something that needs to be done. What I have a problem with is when people try and leverage their position in life by yelling “racism.” Or when they use “racism” to justify their shitty behavior and outlook on life. Or (and I’ve actually seen this happen) saying someone is a racist behind their back because they don’t like the guy and want to make him look bad to the rest of their peers in their social circle.

  13. stanky stanky says:

    Wait, if I watch a lot of interracial pr0n then that means I’m definitely not racist, right?

  14. Hateler says:

    The Bell Curve is funny. It changed my attitude about race, and I’m sure I could easily be labeled a racist. My girlfriend is from Cote d’Ivoire so I certainly fall into the category of racist that Gavin proposes here.

    With the statistics presented in the book, you can actually make inferences about individuals – although with a very wide margin of error. Like, what is the probability that a random black person has an IQ above 100? Your “prejudices” become much more reasonable even in a group of 10 people. You can say, with a great degree of certainy, some very terrible things about a whole neighbourhood.

    Another interesting thing the book mentions is that psychometricians practically have to carry out their research in secret. It’s generally accepted in the Gawk-o-sphere that IQ tests are racist, and have been “debunked” as junk science. At the same time, current math texts are loaded with sample questions where IQ is the parameter of interest.

  15. Hateler says:

    Here’s the best/worst Gawker article ever about IQ – complete with “debunking” links, and an edict declaring the discussion finished: it’s an “agreed-upon fact that race is social, not a biological, construct.”

  16. I don’t believe race is anything more than a social construct. I don’t see how racial realism makes any sort of sense. Oh shit, did I just agree with gawker? Dammit. At least it wasn’t a jezebel article. 😉

  17. Nick Z says:

    Predictably, no one in this thread even attempts to define ‘racism,’ despite protestations that they’re either not racist, or that they can’t be racist because of who they fuck. Why not just say that racism doesn’t exist? Also, let’s just face the fact the whatever question The Bell Curve purports to answer was first asked by a guy who kept a pickled black cock in a jar on his desk, and move on. It’s a fucking irredeemable book by any standard, and Cosma Shalizi’s “debunking” (why the scare quotes?) of general intelligence measurements is pretty thorough.

  18. Oprah says:

    First, I would like to state I am honored to have Jim Goad correct my grammar. Big fan of your appearance on Politically Incorrect with Bill Mahar(he’s not a racist he likes black hookers). Anyways, what seems to be the ACTUAL issue is not “Evil White Liberals(EWL) discrediting racially insensitive commentators(in the words of Jim Goad “Real Talk “), but “I should have the right to say whatever I want and not be reprimanded for it, because I’m not really a bad person”. For example if I came to work drunk and late, I would probably be fired. It’s the same scenario as a writer stating something racially insensitive and losing their job for it. It does not mean that writer is a racist, but they fucked up. When you print something for the masses you are allowing an array of different people with different perspectives to give their opinion on it. Like when John Mayer stated he had the heart of United Benetton, but the cock of David Duke. I thought it was funny, but maybe another token black girl down my multicultural block shed a tear…you never know. So is John Mayer a racist…NO. He was involved in a prolific Dave Chappelle skit that examined the cultural impacts on musical preferences, but was John Mayer being an insensitive dick…YESSS. BEING WHITE IS A CURSE AND A BLESSING, but more of a blessing. Most white people will come from a lower to upper middle class background, and at one point of their lifetime visit Vail, CO. Most will also at some point of their lives be called a racist. Few will lose their job over it. Are the wounds of racism healed…NO, my grandma still looks for a sign before she drinks out the water fountain.
    Words of Wisdom: In my life I’ve had bad experiences with blind people(this is true), imagine if one day I wrote of these experience in a public forum, and wrote quips about Helen Killer and Stevie Wonder, and at the end said “blind people can’t even see this”. Then what would I be seen as, AN INSENSITIVE JERK. If that bothers you then you might have to become a recluse.

  19. Barry says:

    Why is that people who talk about how everyone is race sensitive are race sensitive themselves?

    Your obsession with peoples obsession on race is pretty Cantorian.

    And Goad gets race points for asking Gawker bloggers to walk through the ‘hood’ with him. Coooorny.

  20. BillyAIDSvirus says:

    i once said something on reddit about a i wikipedia article i read about high levels of melanin being linked to aggression in certain types of mammals. i was told to “provide links or retract”. i think way too open minded people are inferior to me, am i racist?

  21. Jim Goad says:

    This ridiculous notion that some of us are trying to “deny” being “racist” presupposes I even agree with your definition of what the word “racist” means. I don’t. It’s an illogical, pseudo-religious word analogous to “sinner” these days.

    Race is real and quantifiable. “Racism” is a pure social construct.

    Keep reading those lines until you understand them, if that’s possible.

  22. Cunt says:

    If racism is a social construct…is not the concept of race it’s self a social construct.

  23. newlibertarian says:

    One thing for sure: No lint left in anyone’s navel.

  24. Hateler says:

    Why is it always: “It’s impossible to measure intelligence, so the Bell Curve is stupid”? What about the data?

    Assume the tests have no purpose, and just consider what they consist of:

    1) Which of these four doesn’t belong: apple, pear, orange, car.
    2) What is the next number in the sequence: 7 6 5 4 3 2 …
    3) etc.

    How would the results of a fun questionnaire reinforce the boundaries of a social construct?

  25. BillyAIDSvirus says:

    who said i didn’t have high levels of melanin?

  26. Raping your slaves is just a WEE bit different than legally marrying someone because you love them as an equal. I am huge racist, so I think I’ll spend my life with someone I think is inferior to me! And introduce him to my parents! I long to have babies with a genetically inferior animal and thereby weaken my pure, strong race — like every racist does. Ohh-kay. If that is the case, then I’d have bigger issues than racism.

  27. “My grandma still looks for a sign before she drinks out the water fountain.”

    Get your grandmother some fucking therapy. It’s 2012.

  28. Baz says:

    Goad, you sound like a kid!

    Dd these comments make you ‘cry liek 4 eva’?

  29. Hornblower's Ghost says:

    @Kyria I brought up the point of slave master fucking the shit out of slaves when nobody was looking, just to point out that it may be a little ridiculous to have roll out interracial relationships as a defense today, they should just be your relationships. A lot of racists used to have a weird pre-occupation with the sexuality of people from groups they claimed they hated, racism was a coping mechanism for their attraction to people from those groups. I’m not saying any of you are racists at all, I’m just saying that if race wasn’t still present in all of our minds, we wouldn’t even need to point out interracial relationships as a defense, they would be our relationships. When will interracial porn just be porn?

  30. Oprah says:

    @Kyria Abrahams: My comment about my grandmother was a joke, but due to your ridiculous response
    “get your grandmother some fucking therapy” I feel like I have to make a point. You have never in your life experienced institutional racism. I do not believe you could even understand what it is like for 30 years of your life be told you are inferior(openly) and second class because of your skin color. My grandmother is 88 years old and born and raised in North Carolina and has a smile on her face every fucking day. So I know Kyria you’re trying to be “cutting edge” and “punk” with your response, but that was a ignorant and dickish thing to state.

  31. Jim Goad says:

    @ “Oprah”

    You have never in your life experienced decades of poverty in a small African village. Count your blessings, lady.

  32. Man man says:

    Everyone wants to be a victim. Even skinheads NB: crucified skin tattoo.

    “Reckoned every skinhead was a bad man / Enough to make an honest man be sick.”

    “It’s your fault / you’ve ruined our lives / we’re the ones you crucify / You’re the ones who commit the crime / but it’s always us who do the time.”
    -Iron Cross

  33. Robin says:

    If only you could say this stuff openly on like, the internet. Oh, you just did? What happened? Nothing? Some people called you dicks? Oh. Er, if you say something and people call you a dick that’s not really censorship. That’s just people thinking you’re dicks. Hey, my wife is Chinese. How many points do I get?

  34. Robin says:

    “Race is real and quantifiable. “Racism” is a pure social construct.”

    I know you think this is really smart. But it is high school logic. Everything is real and quantifiable to some extent. Of course race is. You can measure physical attributes and call them descriptors of a race. The race called Chinese tend to have black hair. You can measure other attributes and call them descriptors of an economic class. They may not be physical but they are still quantifiable. In both cases the attributes themselves, how they are selected and most importantly the role they play in the way you see the world is indeed a social construct. I know you guys love being all “scientific” but when your buddy Derb says that you should avoid helping black people in distress because he has dug up some anecdotes and presented them as quantified evidence of the danger involved, that is not science. That is simply prejudice. And not just because a few anecdotes do not qualify as data but because he has chosen to elevate race as the one factor on which he focuses.

    It seems to me that every generation has young rebels who become middle aged curmudgeons. See various aging punks who now rail against “political correctness gawwwwn mad”. I am seeing more and more aging Gen X’ers that fit that model. I guess you guys are some of them. But I am glad that you are a small minority and I think you will have very little impact on the progress that has been made over the last 50 years. I know you believe that everyone is a frothing racist (or ‘race realist’ or whatever you call it) if only political correctness would let them be. That isn’t true.


  36. stanky stanky says:

    I did enjoy this post and would look forward to seeing more like them in the future. I definitely don’t think Gavin and company are racist (well, except for maybe Derbyshire). But just to play devil’s advocate here:
    Are you saying that just because someone happens to be banging Pocahontas or Mulan, then that automatically means they can’t possibly be racist against anyone? That just sounds kind of silly.

  37. Oprah says:

    @Jim Goad I did grow up in the projects so…same shit

  38. […] There! I fell much better now. A bunch of disreputable politically incorrect intellectuals gathered for some sort of exchange. Worth your atte… […]

  39. whoops says:

    I’m no scientist, but I am pretty sure that the social sciences have all agreed that race is a social construct whereas those who study genetics have a clear, evidenced-based definition of race that is not reliant on the definition of race that was put forward when the mechanism of DNA was barely understood. People still hold on to the idea that race is a social construct when it serves their purposes, but generally the same people would take issue with any suggestion that this renders the notion of affirmative action incomprehensible and absurd.

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